I have moved to Young Composers. =P

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It really does have that 'Laboratory' Feeling to it. And the mice part really fit into everything.
The ending was shocking, But made sense. It sounded as if they were just, Doing what mice do(probably cleaning themselves) and all the sudden... Bah!.. Dead/killed/struck!

The melody stuck in my head for a while after I listened to it.

I liked it. Its really cool, and well put together.

Haha, I'm glad to see another choir nerd around...

I'll comment on the piece in a bit.

Hello and welcome to Ichigos,

I agree with Darkened_Angel that it really does 'sound' like a laboratory. My favourite parts were the ones around 1:38, where it changed mood for a little while. As a musical painting it does seem pretty static overall, but it still has the desired effect.

I didn't really like the orchestration. I understand what you're trying to do with the marimba, but it's way too heavy. Your viola was also lost its quality of being a viola; the nasal timbre just doesn't cut the 'aroma' leitmotifs. I also see that in some parts, the oboe doubles the clarinet, which is something I discourage, unless its used in a way where it needs an awkward sound (which in your case, it didn't). Your other string instruments (excluding viola) were also losing its balance with viola; sometimes the other instruments sounded more important than the viola itself. The overall idea of the piece was decent, but it's just the orchestration that really bugged me.

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Yeah, I'm all for minimalism. Especially Glass' work, I enjoyed his Koyaanisqatsi :) The thing is though, that I admire your idea and thought-process more than the actual result. You may blame me (I would) for not being artistic enough to see through the abstract cloak you've written, but this song of yours is on the border to elevator music in my taste.

You have good compositional skills, I give you that, but I'd like to share a song by a person I once knew. This song is also very minimalistic in nature, and it's only a few seconds in lenght, but it holds a rare quality to it which encourages the listener to have it on repeat before turning it off.

(The skills of the composer of the attached song are obviously sharper than yours, but don't feel discouraged. This composer is a natural, and I think you should study his style further).

I can definitely get the picture, almost feel the whiskers. I love the quirky dissonances of the mice in the lab. The only thing I didn't particularly love was the sound of the viola doubling the mice-instruments, although I can definitely understand the desired effect behind it (which I can still imagine beside the fact that I don't love the sound of that orchestration, so maybe it's good that it sounds bad). I can definitely see the Danny Elfman influence shining through once again, as well.

You have good compositional skills, I give you that, but I'd like to share a song by a person I once knew. This song is also very minimalistic in nature, and it's only a few seconds in lenght, but it holds a rare quality to it which encourages the listener to have it on repeat before turning it off.

(The skills of the composer of the attached song are obviously sharper than yours, but don't feel discouraged. This composer is a natural, and I think you should study his style further).

It's quite funny that you should mention me (this is "the artist formerly known as" Ureshii Gaki, by the way... you can check the name change thread ^~) whenever you talk to Nuclear Foetus... because the fact of the matter is...

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I know, which is partly why I posted 'your' old song which I dug up from my heap of old files. I personally felt that the old you had a better effect on me, compositional-wise.

Oh, and I wanted to mess with you since one of my spies informed me that you had a dual-account, which is prohibited here.

I am Ureshii Gaki/Liquid Feet. I understand that I could just say that, but I'm sure that by...

Switching between computers (each signed on to a different name) in order to type this message, you'll be able to see that this is, indeed...

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just listened to "Laboratory Mice, very nice indeed. And I LIKE the marimba as it is...

Hahahaha, I was wondering about that. I'm like "wait, isn't that Ureshii Gaki's old composition anyway?! Does he KNOW they're the same person???"

Anyway... if we can, let's all put that past us and refer toPost #7 (http://forums.ichigos.com/showpost.php?p=375087&postcount=7) (and everything before it). :heh:

But... my post, apart from the messing-around-with-you, was indeed my subtle way of telling you that enjoyed your past style better. :think:

Edit: And for goodness sake appreciate my far-fetched joke or I'll ban you for having a dupe-account!

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Wow, lengthy post, but oh well, I guess I'll have to explain in depth either ways.

1.) When you said the marimba felt too 'raw' (or naked, in your term), you're wrong. A real marimba (the real instrument, not that synthetic sound you have from Finale), is much more resonant and can hold a note for a fair amount of time compared to xylophone or glockenspiel, which leads to the fact that it can be clustered if performed live. But since you want a marimba, a solution to this is dead stroking (hit the marimba and let the sticks stay; this effect leaves a very static yet 'ticking' sound) every beat to make it less clustered.

2.) When you said you wanted the viola to fall in and out of the string texture, I don't really think you've achieved that desired effect. The reason is that the viola has a very distinct nasal quality (as I've said before) in its lower register, hence the fact that if your passage is low, it will stand out from your violins and won't 'fall into' your texture. But if you have the viola in its higher register, it will then blend in, and won't be able to distinct itself from violins, which was what I mainly heard from the piece since you exposed the high register more than the low.

3.) Bars 49 - 56: you said your instruments soar above the texture right? Perhaps this may not apply totally to your piece, but a word of warning, clarinet in its high register has a very wooden and dry sound while oboe has a piercing sound, and when you double them in unison, it would sound like a screwdriver drilling a hole (unless professional musicians play it, which is highly unlikely for most amateur composers here).

4.) Bar 69, if you find a rattle too cliched to do your job, just use tremolo strings.

5.) When you claimed me wrong on the oboe and clarinet doubling, I think you misunderstood the concept of 'awkward sound'. What I mean by awkward sound is not two opposite timbres playing together. It's more like two contrasting timbres playing together. The oboe is considered nasal and has a piercing tone while the clarinet is round and rather hollow in the middle to bottom register. So when they play together in unison, you'll have a sound that's like 'a toothpick piercing through a drinking straw'. Therefore, oboe and clarinet does not attract. However, if you do want a playful/scherzo-esque sound, bassoon and oboe does the job. But if you complain bassoon is too low, there's always oboe d'amore, English horn, tenoroon and other less common instruments for substitute.

6.) The marimba is fine with its rhythm and whatnot, as stated above, my only concern is its possibility of clustering with its own notes. Also, you could've turned down the volume from the very beginning so that it's more background-like element throughout. The ostinato itself was fine, however.

7.) The viola wasn't effective, however, it's better than a cello. As stated before, viola's nasal quality is better to present darker melodies (however, dark can also mean humorous), but your piece (or at least your viola usage) was fairly bright, hence the imbalance. And no, viola doesn't get a lot of love, which I agree, but I guess the classical masters didn't use it for the reason I stated above: the viola's sound is too idiosyncratic compared to the other string instruments. Also, when you said the viola wasn't important, I disagree. You gave it a lot of soli and important motifs to 'respond' to the woodwinds' 'calls', hence the fact that it is important.

8.) Yes, the scherzando feel is definitely there, it's just that the presentation of the piece felt lacking in my opinion.

9.) Don't worry, I don't feel attacked or anything since orchestration is my passion, I'm just giving you input in my opinion and in my own style.

To Sir_Dotdotdot ~

Thank you! Your first post was appreciated, too, but what this post had was what the other post hadn't: explanations as to why the orchestration bugged you and advice on how to alleviate the problems. =D

For me... if it weren't for the fact that the strings twisting around each other isn't noticeable at all and that the low, unexplainable rumble beneath the track could never be fixed... I would say that the mp3 itself is as close to perfection as I could possibly make it. However, I pushed the limits of a lot of the instruments (while keeping everything in what is considered "practical" range for each instrument) without really knowing how each instrument actually handles those extremes in real life... so yes, this piece is flawed. I actually had the pleasure of playing the Marimba a while ago and noticed that, though it was resonating like you said, it wasn't a lot of resonation. So... Though I disagree with your comments on the Marimba (I think that, the Cello, and the two Violins are the only instruments that I got just right in this piece), your comments on the Oboe, Clarinet, and Viola make a lot of sense to me... I'll consider changing the instrumentation whenever I get to college at the end of the week: that's when I'll be surrounded with musicians who can play (and hopefully perform!) my work.

Following up to your previous post:

Yes, perhaps the marimba isn't the most important issue of the piece, however, since you said it's playing on every beat and every second, I just fear that the 'remnants' of every struck note will interfere with the next (however, this really depends on a few factors, such as the instrument itself, the sticks used and the performer's style). However, this can be dealt with by the performer and may vary depending on the sticks the marimba player uses (which is another thing you should indicate on your score too, do you want the percussionist to use a soft yearn stick, medium rubber stick or a hard rubber stick?). And my comment about tuning the dynamic down a notch retains, as I really think it will convey a 'lab' feel if it's a whispering ostinato.

Nevertheless, as I stated above, some of the comments and suggestions I made can be altered, could have alternative solutions, and are merely opinions to some degree.

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