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poozer115
August 12th, 2011, 05:24 pm
Writing a little piano piece, but can't figure out which chord to use for the fourth line. Ideally, it would go back to the chord of the first line after the fourth. It is easy to resolve the chord if my ultimate intent was to go back to B minor, but in this case I want to go back to Bb. Dissonance is okay of course. I've been struggling with this for a while and have found no good result.

For the record, if it's hard to read my handwriting, the first chord is (minus the falling soprano) Bb, F, Gb, C, Db. The second chord is A, E, Gb, B, Db. The third chord is G, D, Gb, B, D. Thanks.

poozer115
August 12th, 2011, 05:25 pm
I am open to other ideas too though, like going to a new chord, or even abandoning my pattern if it makes sense.

kentaku_sama
August 12th, 2011, 08:20 pm
Ok so that's an unusual progression you've got there. What you essentially have is a Bbm9 - Amaj9 - Gmaj7 - ??? - Bm9 progression.
Those extra notes your playing are not part of the chord from what I can tell but if you intended them to than i'd be different. They're more melodic elements. I think a normal choice would be F9 (F,Eb, -- A - G) chord but if you want something a little different you could do like a Ebm6/9 (Eb, C -- F#,C,F). What do you think of those? :sweat:

clarinetist
August 12th, 2011, 09:42 pm
I put it through Finale, and quite honestly, I want to hear a V chord of some sort in b♭ minor, which would help you to get back to your first line. I'll post up the details of my analysis as soon as I'm done here.

Edit: Here's how I would analyze the progression:

b♭ minor (C♮ is a nonharmonic lower neighbor, G♭ is an unprepared neighbor tone) -> e♮š7 (with the A♮ in the bass treated as a passing tone) -> G♮Maj7 (with the G♭ respelled as an F♯). If you were to use Roman numeral analysis, in b♭ minor, you could see it as:

i -> viiš7/V -> ♮V(Maj7)/iiš.

I think if you were to apply Schenkerian Analysis to this (I have no idea if I'm doing this right, by the way), you would see it as:

I -> ♮IV -> ♮VI

which reveals one thing: you're moving by the traditional descending fifth from I -> ♮IV, but then you insert a retrogression into ♮VI. My ears want to hear a V chord after the ♮VI, which would make sense - due to the unstable nature of the viiš7/V (or the ♮IV) in b♭. So, therefore, the most logical progression to put in here would be:

i -> viiš7/V -> ♮V(Maj7)/iiš -> V -> i, which would help you get back to your first line. Using Schenker:

I -> ♮IV -> ♮VI -> V -> I.

However, overall, minus the retrogression, you eventually get a progression of:

I -> ♮IV -> V -> I,

which agrees with Schenkerian Theory (or how little I know about it).

So, it would make sense to put an F chord of some sort after the G♮Maj7, and then, you'll be able to lead yourself back to the chord of the first line. :)

EDIT2: I rewrote the 12th measure, and inserted the viiš7/V there to make the transition to V smoother, and then added a Ger+6 (which you'll learn in the Theory III class, if you haven't learned it already) in b♭ minor to i(6/4) -> V -> i, which is the desired result. See attachment. Sorry about the rit. at the end of the .mp3; it's a Finale tendency.

kentaku_sama
August 13th, 2011, 12:14 am
Dang clarinetist, you must have went to college for music or something cause I thought I was a music theory freak. :heh:
Could you give me some insight on using dissonance in different progressions
because all I know is the [Diminished Chord resolving up a halfstep], [mMaj7 chord on the iv of a major progression], [Diatonic Major seven chords moving down ] and [Half-diminished resolving up or down half steps], I use these all the time and I want to do something else with dissonance in a normal major or minor key. I want to know more ideas for dissonance with resolution I can do that preferably don't involve the V7 or halfstep resolutions. Just message me :)

clarinetist
August 13th, 2011, 01:42 am
Poozer and I actually attend the same uni. - we're both music majors. :)

kentaku_sama
August 13th, 2011, 02:11 am
Poozer and I actually attend the same uni. - we're both music majors

Cool, no wonder, I decided I'm gonna major in music in college. I haven't has any music education other than 3 years of piano lessons and the internet but piano classes were only sheet music nothing about harmony or dissonance but I've managed to figure stuff out slowly. Clarinetist, were my suggestions good because came up with those chords in like 2 minutes on a computer, actually less than a year ago I didn't even know anything about dissonance or substitution so I can't believe how much I know, not bragging just amazed at how fast I picked up complexed harmony almost totally by ear. I come up with my own harmony though too because I actually invent my own rules for working with compositions written entirely in modes like locrian and phrygian. :heh: