Well, here they are in one thread. Feedback if you would.

Definitely not an orchestral or symphonic piece, as you say it... It feels like an electronica piece with synthy instruments trying to imitate real instruments as it lacks that 'orchestral' feel with your way of orchestrating, harmonizing, and 'styling' it. Furthermore, your percussion is to popular music like. Also, your orchestration is too messy in my opinion, everything just blabbered together with not colour and character definition. If you really have an urge to do something for symphonic orchestra, read some orchestration books. A book I recommend would be The Study of Orchestration by Samuel Adler.

As for orchestrating a crescendo, it doesn't really matter in my opinion, as long as you don't start with forte brass or forte timpani. There are a few ways to orchestrate a penetrating crescendo. An effective way can be through repetition and adding certain instruments at certain points, or you can build a crescendo 'vertically' by building up a chord to a climax point.

Well, that was my comment from the other thread for your Weeping Willow piece.

As for your other piece...

It has a nice progression at first, but your melody seems to interfere with it for a while. You have a good idea of what you want to do, but the way you executed it felt a little to thin as you could've used much more richer harmonies. I also think that your melody should be more justified, by that I mean you should have more structure to your piece, cos I did not hear enough repetition or form in your piece. I also assume your piece is not complete, right?

Nice try.

Thanks for the reply. Yes both are incomplete.

Katie- It's, overall, a good 'ambient' piece (i.e. game, scenery music) but not much of a piece you'd sit down and listen to alone--feels it should go with something. I agree with the comments Sir_Dot said, and I liked how he described the piece's orchestration and harmonies as 'thin.' As said (again) give us more of a melody that we can reconize, and a good harmony to compliment the feelings that the melody is conveying; The progression is nice, but it falls apart when the strings come in. . .It might be the Soundfonts you're usuing, but those accents in the strings seem very out of place and almost too bouncy. Keep it going, I'd like to hear it finished.

Weaping Hills- Same comments as Sir_dot again. Maybe I would layer your backgrounds better before going all techy with the speakers. You seem to 'layer' your backgrounds that don't compliment with each other very. But (and this is orchestrating/counter-point tips) but You backgrounds compliment the chords and melody, but not the other backgrounds themselves. . .It may be hard to understand, but I do know what I'm saying.

Remember, you're starting out, it doesn't matter weither your first compositions don't go over well; mine surely didn't, and still some I make now suck too. . .

Good luck, and HAVE FUN.

Thanks for all the replies. Yes, I should have mentioned that I (in my happy little world in my head =D) intended for my music to be played along with a video game or movie. Sort of exciting back ground music. My goal in life is to write music for video games, that would rock. Only have a few years until college though =(. Hope I make it.

Well, that was my comment from the other thread for your Weeping Willow piece.

As for your other piece...

It has a nice progression at first, but your melody seems to interfere with it for a while. You have a good idea of what you want to do, but the way you executed it felt a little to thin as you could've used much more richer harmonies. I also think that your melody should be more justified, by that I mean you should have more structure to your piece, cos I did not hear enough repetition or form in your piece. I also assume your piece is not complete, right?

Nice try.Was it decent though? This is only my second actually full symphonic piece. Most the music i write it for piano/ violin duet. Thanks for the tip on the book by the way, I ordered in on amazon. Hope it helps =D.

I can't say if it's 'good' or not, because music is an opinion-oriented thing after all. However, I can tell you, it's not my cup of tea. Don't get discourage though, just because I don't like it doesn't mean other people can't. But if you're asking for a more techinical 'why', then I can tell you the following: 1.) your orchestration was rather weak 2.) your foreground, middleground and background elements didn't work well together for my taste 3.) it's waaaaayyy too popular influenced, it just doesn't have that orchestral push to it.

I do realize your goal in music is to strive for successful incidental music, so I guess it's not 100% vital for you to learn too much orchestration technique. In fact, for starters, you should look into electronic music equally as much as orchestral music. I am also surprised that you ordered the book that fast, since it isn't really the cheapest book to buy (or at least it wasn't, when I bought it)...

Out of the two, I preferred the Weeping Hills. Though I do hear what everyone else was saying about some parts not fitting together well, it didn't seem to bother me much in this piece. Though I agree with both Sir_DotDotDot and Mazeppa, I do think you're off to a pretty good start with Weeping Hills. I would work on extending it just a bit - though it may not be the best piece for a full symphony, I think it'd be great as a video game piece, which is good since that's your goal. :P

On a final note, I'll say that while it does sound rather pop-influenced, I wouldn't say that's a bad thing.

I hope to hear more from you! :)

As I said before: ("Weeping Hills")


There's something I didn't like in the Double Bass at :15. Low strings (sometimes low woodwinds/brass) need time to 'speak', and fast notes (in my opinion) on just Double Bass (sometimes Cello, too) makes it seem very rushed. The crescendo didn't go well, in my opinion (:29 to :32). When orchestrating a crescendo, I try to follow the following format:

Start----------------------------------Finish
Strings> Woodwinds> Brass> (Strong) Percussion

As for your other one, I can't think of much to say :\.

I can't say if it's 'good' or not, because music is an opinion-oriented thing after all. However, I can tell you, it's not my cup of tea. Don't get discourage though, just because I don't like it doesn't mean other people can't. But if you're asking for a more techinical 'why', then I can tell you the following: 1.) your orchestration was rather weak 2.) your foreground, middleground and background elements didn't work well together for my taste 3.) it's waaaaayyy too popular influenced, it just doesn't have that orchestral push to it.

I do realize your goal in music is to strive for successful incidental music, so I guess it's not 100% vital for you to learn too much orchestration technique. In fact, for starters, you should look into electronic music equally as much as orchestral music. I am also surprised that you ordered the book that fast, since it isn't really the cheapest book to buy (or at least it wasn't, when I bought it)...The book was $50 dollars used on amazon. After I read the reviews I figured it was worth it. I'd have only bought fantasy books, manga, and video games anyways with that money =D. I figure it was better spent this way.

The book was $50 dollars used on amazon. After I read the reviews I figured it was worth it. I'd have only bought fantasy books, manga, and video games anyways with that money =D. I figure it was better spent this way.

It costs like a hundred bucks when I bought it. XD Oh well, books get cheaper by years...

Yeah, amazon is a beautiful thing =D! Feedback, anyone else?

Ok, here, I've started another song. This is a cello and two violin piece. It's about halfway done, but i felt like getting some feedback on how it's going. I know it's tinny, but I decided to compose the real way (using Melody Assistant instead of Garageband) and the software has retched instrument effects. However, with this software I was able to include a midi file so that feedback can be more thorough. Anyways, I realize it's basic and kinda slow, but my goal wasn't to make a complex song, but a pretty one. Anyways, feedback please.

I can see what you wanted to create with "Invention 1" but either the Mp3 or the MIDI does this song justice, haha. It's pretty nice actually, it reminds me of a Bach(?) tune I've heard...

I can see what you wanted to create with "Invention 1" but either the Mp3 or the MIDI does this song justice, haha. It's pretty nice actually, it reminds me of a Bach(?) tune I've heard...Yeah, when it's done I might ask some people in a teen symphony I'm in to accompany me with a recording. Just so I have a quality version to show people.

Ok, i finished the song. Here it is. Also, my dad all of the sudden went crazy and bought me Finale... so erm, I now have a good music program, w00t!

It's pretty nice actually, it reminds me of a Bach(?) tune I've heard...

Same comments; and yeah, it sounds like 'Prelude' from Bach's The Well Tempered Klavier XD But it's no where to call it a rip off, don't worry.

Good stuff, keep doing things like this to build melody, harmony and counterpoint. ^_^

Thanks for the feedback!

Which version of Finale do you have, because if it's 2006, 2007, or 2008, it should be better quality sound than what you have.

(S)he uses GarageBand, a sequencing (not notation) program.

Argh Clarinetist can you get off my case =D. I thought I already explained this to you... First off, garageband is in fact a notation program, as well as a sequencing program, both are built in. I wrote this piece using melody assistant, finale 2007 is in the mail, it should arrive sometime soon.

Which version of Finale do you have, because if it's 2006, 2007, or 2008, it should be better quality sound than what you have.2008..? It's only 2007 =D, how would i have 2008..

Argh Clarinetist can you get off my case =D. I thought I already explained this to you... First off, garageband is in fact a notation program, as well as a sequencing program, both are built in. I wrote this piece using melody assistant, finale 2007 is in the mail, it should arrive sometime soon.

Sorry, forgot. :heh: And Finale 2008 is out; MakeMusic releases the next year's program the summer before the actual year starts.

*leaves*

Hey, BTW poozer115, try not to double post if it can be avoided. Use the edit function instead. Anyway, if you have 2007, full version of Finale, you should be able to use Finale's built in version of Garritan Personal Orchestra, which comes with some really great orchestral samples (if he had bought 2008, though, there are apparently a ton more samples in the GPO version that comes with it).

Yeah, I'll be using all of those functions when it arrives soon =D. Yippeaa. I just checked, I got the 2008 version...that still seems weird to me though =D.

Oh, I thought you meant you already had it. Still, if you have 2008, I'm jealous...

Oh, I thought you meant you already had it. Still, if you have 2008, I'm jealous...Yeah, I'm hoping that it's all it's made up to be. Thanks for feedback everyone.

Well, Finale 2008 came. W00t! It's amazing. I rewrote "Invention 1" in Finale so it sounds beautiful now =). I didn't include the MIDI as it's the same song, it just sounds loads better =D. Tell me what you guys think!

Wow that sounds so beautiful. Is this really the original sound in Finale 2008? And your Invention 1 is really nice.

Wow that sounds so beautiful. Is this really the original sound in Finale 2008? And your Invention 1 is really nice.Oh thank you =). Um, this isn't the sound of Finale 2008, but the program comes bundled with Kontact software, which lets you use the Finale notation program along with Kontact's Garriton Instruments. Yeah, I'm really pleased with it =).

It reminds me too much of Ave Maria by Gounod-Bach. It's more romantic than baroque, in my opinion. Also, don't you think it's a little too tiresome for the cello to play arppegios all the way through? Give it some interesting parts. Your violins and/or violin and viola can also do more than just a slow melody.

It reminds me too much of Ave Maria by Gounod-Bach. It's more romantic than baroque, in my opinion. Also, don't you think it's a little too tiresome for the cello to play arppegios all the way through? Give it some interesting parts. Your violins and/or violin and viola can also do more than just a slow melody.Thanks for the feedback.

I would never notice it sounds similar to Ave Maria if Sir_dotdotdot didn't mention. It reminded me of Prelude from Bach's Cello Suite No. 1. I don't think it sounds romantic, there isn't the dynamics and range of a romantic piece, sounds more classical. You can add more ornaments to bring out the baroque feel if you are aiming for that, I think.

^ That was the song I was thinking of aswell, The prelude of the Cello Suite.

Dang it =(. Now I'm stuck with my original song being frighteningly similar to a handful of famous songs =(. Bad luck, argh.

Here's the first bit of my new song. I've nicknamed it "Swallow" for now, until I think of a more befitting title. Anyways, once again, I'm having trouble figuring out the sound on Finale 2008, so it's super quiet. Sorry for the inconvenience.

It got really annoying after like the fifth time repeating the same thing over and then when the pizzicato came in, it just made it worse.

YAYAYAYAY!!!! I figured out the sound problem =D. Here's "Swallow" again, with revised sound and volume. Enjoy (i hope)!

I wrote a bit more.. I'm only posting this again cause there's a terrible transition from the old part to the new part. If you guys have any advice on how to fix it, would be appreciated =D.

First of all, you've got some technical issues here. Some instruments sound as if they were like 30 metres away, while some don't.

The start is pretty good, but the way you presented it I thought it would lead somewhere, like a climax of some sort - definately not break and repeat!

I agree completely, do you have any ideas where and how i could input a climax though, as well as how I could allow a climax to segwey into the mellow section i have after?

Yes I do, but if there's one thing I've learned here it is that people go in the complete opposite direction of my advice and build and progress on their own, which is quite what a good composer ought to do.

I agree, but on the off chance that the advice you give that I do not agree with sparks a unique thought in my mind, completely of my own making, I wonder if you could still share your advice.

Help..anyone? =(

How about forgetting this project, delete it and move on?

It's that bad..?

I would never notice it sounds similar to Ave Maria if Sir_dotdotdot didn't mention. It reminded me of Prelude from Bach's Cello Suite No. 1. I don't think it sounds romantic, there isn't the dynamics and range of a romantic piece, sounds more classical. You can add more ornaments to bring out the baroque feel if you are aiming for that, I think.Sorry I overlooked your post =(. Saw it while going back through the thread. Thanks a lot for your input =). Yeah, I was definitely shooting for romantic, but I am still familiarizing myself with Finale and haven't quite got the hang of dynamics yet. Were it to be played live though there would be a lot of volume change.

New song. I know it's not fun to listen to =D, but I envisioned it as a sword of trailer..with lots of dramatic swords clashing and screaming men =D. I dunno, tell me what you think.

The mp3 sounds very low and did you get the idea from Requiem for a dream? When I heard it the first thing that came to my mind was "Lux Aeterna" (Eternal light) From Requiem for a dream.

What's Requiem for a Dream? I'm not familiar with the piece. Is the composer somebody I might know?

Requiem for a Dream is a movie, the composer is Clint Mansell and Lux Aeterna is a piece from the film.

It was pretty OK, but be you used some pretty nasty aug. 4ths around :37. . .and also watch your development of the chords at 1:00.

I just wrote some more on Weeping Hills, here it is.

Anyone?

Well I'm back after a long break. My first year of highschool is pretty loaded and I've been busy with homework. I'll upload a little piece i've been working on soon.

Only thirty seconds so far, but if I could get some general feedback it would be awesome.

It felt that the melody and the phrase wants to be longer. The phrase felt too abrupt, extending the melody and the progression might help.

I didn't feel like that at all, but I did feel there's not enough of it there yet to be able to say anything; it's not very exciting yet at all.

^ What the two before me said.

I can say that I do like this (although I agree with the comments Dot and Death stated) but I feel like this is not "attention" grabbing. It starts out with a farily nice piano introduction; but the violin seems very pathetic, if not, depressive. It leads into your chord change well, but it doesn't start or end as well as that little excerpt did.

Keep trying, this could prove to be something fairly OK.

I see potential, you need to develop this better and we can give you better feed back. (Yeah, I said what everyone else basically said. :P )

Thanks for the feedback everybody! I'll upload the longer version whenever I get that far.