First time composer... just 24 measures. (not completed yet, either).

-Piano part is not expected to be playable.:heh:

EDIT: Switched patch for solo instrument... Give comments.

the piece thus far is very nice though if i may make one recomendation rather than ahving a decrescendo on the lead instrument following the crescendo u may want to try a solfrezando. It will be slightly more dramatic, while still ahving the same effect, as well as audible on the finale program.
I was also wondering why u say the piano part is not expected to be playable, my primary instrument is trumpet but i beleive i could even manage my way through it, certainly a skilled pianist would be able to.

try to work on your harmonies...they were gratingx_x
the piano part IS playable, in fact very simple, don't worry;)

Thanks for comments. What is a solfrezando?... I googled it and couldn't find it.

on finale it appears as the abreviation sfz. this symbol tells the musician to hit the note a bit more loudly (this will lead right up from the crescendo) and then to quickly soften the note. hope that helps a little:sweat:

Thanks for comments. What is a solfrezando?... I googled it and couldn't find it.

The full word should be sforzando (meaning suddenly loud), if I didn't spell it wrong... :think:

^That's what I thought... see first post (switched a few things).

Hmmm... That's very good for a beginner. Something actually got in my head, and it had a pretty good sense of structure. Good job, and keep working on it. :)

I just added 5 measures. Give Comments (especially on the measure 24-25 transition).

EDIT: Will post composition when ready.... :heh:

Um... May I ask why did you change it into A flat minor/ C flat major? It's a little to hard key for a beginner... :think: As for your piece, you shouldn't change too much, I know you're trying to be complex, but keep it simple, composing isn't always about virtuoso parts and stuff like that. I also have to agree with Marlon, the theme is indeed quite uninteresting, make it remarkable. Furthermore, there are some weird dynamic markings (ie: sfz after a crescendo, cos if you have a crescendo, you need it to be suddenly loud in your case). Good luck, experience is what you need... ;)

Ain't bad. There isn't much to it now, so I can't really give it a proper critique. Well.. I can. The sFz sounds kinda bad in my case. Really OUT THERE AHH! and then goes back to a 'p' right away.

Keep with it.

Added measures 25-38...

I feel like I added the key change in measure 19 for nothing now... :\


Are the new measures I added completely random?....

The transition from the D flat major part to the G minor part doesn't work out... :think:

I see that.. (a 1/2 step... :heh: )... except it was Bb Minor to G Minor...

EDIT: Made a new transition on the 2 key signatures. Is the Solo Instrument at a good volume?.... :unsure:

Sorry for double posting....

Comments Please!

From 38 measures.... now to 146 measures :lol: !

Give comments on organization.... and how it sounds... (sorry, had to repeat a few phrases 3 times :heh: ).

The Key Signature change I really need comments on is the key change (Minor to Major) in Measure 98.

Reminder: Piano Part is not always playable...

Nice melody, but you kept repeating and repeating and repeating... It got me bored half way through. Try to add more melodies in it...

What ^ said. It got rather repetitive. But after a while, it got better. None the less, until about measure 100 or so, it was rather boring. Anyways, good job! Especially for a beginner composition! :)

Comments Please... <_<

Added an Adagio Part at the ending of the song... and deleted measures...

2nd Composition (intro)... Give Comments!<_< .

-Piano part is not expected to be playable.

Needless to say... but that was pretty weak. Reminded me of Kryptonite also.

edit: What do you mean, "piano part is not playable"? Even *I* can play that.

That's it? Lol.

Yup, it's very weak. The chord progressions are nice... too bad a million+ songs use that exact same chord prog. =/ And the piano part is indeed playable.... even Noir can play it! *gasp*

I don't play piano.... (it says, it's not expected to be playable).

Yeah. And we're simply telling you it is playable. :\

I'm sorry, but I still have to say it's boring to the upmost level. I fell asleep through your song... Sorry... harsh but true... and the piano parts ARE playable. They're considered easy if you compare them to tanovev's arrangements (now THOSE are near unplayable if you have short fingers. Like me... :cry: ).

3rd composition...

Give specific comments... (tempos, dynamics, etc...)...

(I decided to delete that last one).

The first section was too simple. I mean, simplicity is good if you can use it right... but the way you used it sounded very amateurish (most of us are amateurs, but that doesn't mean we have to sound like we are). That Am-G-F-G pattern gets old after three measures, yet you kept nagging it for quite a while. Also, this slow-death effect was even amplified by your choice of left hand. Onetwothree...Onetwothree...

The following section however was better. Here you used a similiar pattern, but it didn't feel like drowning in a tub of worms like the first part. The flute work here was also better, but I'd give more time for the piano. Just a suggestion ;) Oh, and is this composition finished? If so, the ending didn't give closure =\

It's not finished yet... the last chord... just didn't sound right.

Oh, I like it. The melody really stands out in this compositions compared to your your previous. Some parts could be thicker in harmony, especially in the climax (just my opinion :P)... make a fatter bassline, to bring out the emotion.

And the last chord, I think, should be followed with a C major after the F major - so it goes back to the root. Someone prob has a better suggestion. =S

Nice work, keep it up!

I finished it with a Cmin chord. (Too bad the 2nd to last measure had that chord too...)...

The Bass Part is still not fixed... :heh:

Hmmm... Noir stole those words from my lips. I agree with him.

-Expanded bass part in the A Minor Part (I still don't know what to do with the C Minor Part).
-Added Rolled Chords
-Added a cadence at the end (I have no idea if it was used correctly :unsure: ).

Specific Comments Please :).

Personally, I like it like this ending ;) But yours is still good. =) I like it much better now. :lol:

Sounds good. Good job.

Great job! It's, as the people above have said, much better. Again, great job, and keep it up! ^_^

-Added an A Minor Part for the ending.

Comments Please :) .

Also, if anyone has Finale 2006, can someone make this into a MIDI (with Human Playback)?

For your newest piece, yes indeed, it has a nicer touch than your older versions, but the repeating progression got on my nerves for a moment, although you do have variations on the melody, the overall impression is still repetitive; it felt kind of annoying after a while too, sorry if that sounded too harsh. Furthermore, the accompaniments got old quite quickly, so work on that. Your transitions to different keys are also too rushed and unprepared, I suggest you to stay away from changing keys in the middle of a piece until you have more experience with theory and whatnot. Also, your slurs are awkward, especially when you play arppegios, you tend to not slur the first note but the rest, which is a weird movement, so you should change that. Good luck. :)

Thanks for the critism (sp?) :) (not sarcasm).

I transposed the previous composition to Bb Minor, and added a few extra things.

It's good, but you still need to work one two places of my suggest.

Theres two spots with some VERY PAINFULL chords in place. The change from Bb Minor to C Minor, and the Coda with the piano's right hand is really weird and hurts my ears.

Keep it up, great song, just needs the final... "tuning."

I don't want to make a thread about this, but is there anywhere I can find ways people add modulation (key signature changes) in their song(s)? I'm pretty bad with the transition notes.

Make it longer than one quick measure-that's a start.

EDIT - Or do some type of fantasia to lead into that key, or just start the melody right away, no transition.

I don't want to make a thread about this, but is there anywhere I can find ways people add modulation (key signature changes) in their song(s)?

Here you can ask about stuff like that (and will likely get an answer) http://forums.ichigos.com/showthread.php?t=1209

Comments Please :) . It's just an intro, for now.

In my opinion, the left hand could be better, and another thing I've noticed - All your songs are in 3/4 and have a piano and a flute. XD You might want to experiment more; it'll really help. Personally, a lot of the stuff in that piece sounded rather cliche, but you're starting, so I'm guessing you're excused. After all, you're starting great.

Good job, I suppose. ^_^ Keep it up!

Ok here are some thoughts:

Try going higher with the flute (pitch-wise)
Add some pedaling
The first two bars sound very false. Those right hand notes come in wrong if you ask me.

Agreed with last two comments.

:heh: I've researched about piano pedaling (I don't play piano), but I still don't get how it works.

Holding the pedal is basically equvalent to holding down all the keys you press wihtout letting go... so it sustains the note until it diminishes. It basically helps brings up the colours of the chord rather than blocky bland notes. When composing/playing broken chord music, it's preferable.

Ahem, if you're making fugal, Bach type, avoid it or "die" says my teacher. =S

Hope that helps! =)

Please.

Don't spam.

Spammers = Die time...

For those that don't know: I take Video Game Sheet Music Requests, and I made these Arrangements from that.

<__<

You take requests for sheet music and transcribe them so that they aren't PLAYABLE? Are you totally missing the point of sheet music?

What do you mean not playable? They look fine. >_>

clarinetist edited his/her post. It said "I make sheet music... it isn't supposed to be playable, especially Dwarves theme" before.

LOL! WTF? That's quite strange. XD

Hmm, yes that would be very hard-the counterpoint in the right hand in those few measures.

Anyway, I think if it was edited a little better, it would be playable, unless you can switch very fast (See Liszt's "La Campanella").

-_-

I just decided to post a composition before school starts.

It's III... from a couple of posts ago, and for some reason, I felt the pedaling was unnecessary in this composition.

Hmmm... That's a pretty good song! Keep it up. :)

I think I figured out why I like it so much... it reminds me so much of the .hack game for PS2. Played it? I'll find the mp3.

:heh: I've researched about piano pedaling (I don't play piano), but I still don't get how it works.

Basically pedalling is use when there is unreachable note.We also use pedal to enrich the chord to make it sounds more grand xD.U can also use pedal when there is same harmony.
Places which u shouldn't use pedals are on running notes and trills.

Hope this helps.

Off topic:I am not sure whether this is true or false,but in recent research i found that using pedals on continuously different chords may sound better than changing pedals when they are different chords.

I think I figured out why I like it so much... it reminds me so much of the .hack game for PS2. Played it? I'll find the mp3.

I've heard of the songs (Ichigos.com)... but I haven't played it (meaning the game).

It's perfect to my ear.

You key change was A LOT more cleaner that it's "before" editions of the song.

Great ending too, keep it like that.

Is there any way I can make III better?.... I'm running out of ideas :heh: .

An orchestrated version?

^I was thinking about that... maybe I'll try it...

^I was thinking about that... maybe I'll try it...

But I'll be tough on criticizing on it... :P Heh, so yeah, study orchestration before starting (please please please study the range of each instruments and doubling, very important stuff), orchestration isn't easy, but it's fun once you have a concept of how it is done. ;) Finally, orchestrating a piece takes a LONG time, so if you don't have the patience, I'd suggest you to reconsider, and for now, start off with something chamber, don't do a symphonic orchestra yet. Good luck. :)

please please please study the range of each instruments and doubling, very important stuff

Range- I've been studying ranges (of at least band instruments) for about 2 years now... just strings now.
Doubling- I know how it works, but, what's the point of it?...

Range- I've been studying ranges (of at least band instruments) for about 2 years now... just strings now.
Doubling- I know how it works, but, what's the point of it?...

What do you mean what's the point of it? You can't blatantly double a bassoon in unison with a piccolo (I mean, come on, it's impossible), or you can't let the oboe over shadow the flute and band woodwinds usually have a weaker range than orchestral woodwinds, although it's vice versa for brass, so study study study!!!!!!! :P

Edit: Now you're at it, let me give you a few more pointers, I'd suggest you to also study about climaxes, chording and voicing each instrument in harmonic backgrounds, fore-, mid- and background elements, transposed instruments (and why/how they are used), notating percussions (very annoying and long subject), and some easy special effects for each instruments (ie harmonics for strings, glissandi for harps, and etc... but don't go into 20th century stuff, as you can hardly reproduce the real sounds of it via MIDI or Finale). If you have any questions/concerns, just ask around here, I'm sure someone or myself can help you. Even if no one can, I still have my trusty orchestration books and I think the books can somewhat answer your future questions... :P

PS: There's a little tutorial on orchestrating based on Rimsky-Korsakov's Principles of Orchestration on the Garritan forums, so you should possibly check that out, all though some of the stuff would be a little outdated as it's written more than 100 years ago. ;)

Well, good luck, don't disappoint us~! ;)

notating percussions (very annoying and long subject),

I doubt I'll be using percussion :heh: ...

I doubt I'll be using percussion :heh: ...

XD You'd want to though, believe me, at first, I didn't want to touch anything percussion, but hey, sleigh bells and clave combo gives an awesome sense of orientalism, and wind chimes are wonderful... So I bet that you'll be tempted to use them when you orchestrate. :P

Ignore this post... :heh:

Way.. way.. too.. SLOW.

I like it, even though I find the start is way to slow, I tried speeding it up a bit ^^

Ah lol I knew I've heard it before I just didn't recognize it, but still I thinks it's better when it's faster!

:sweat:

Way.. way.. too.. SLOW....
I must have posted that by accident... That's not my song...It's BEETHOVEN'S

*edits it out*

EDIT: I was going to post the composition, but I'll study a bit more.

Trust me, I know it wasn't you. You can't compose that good. ^_^ (Wow I'm a rude fuck eh?)

Anyway, I know that's Beethoven-why do you think I said it was way too slow? Uh, because it's mean't to be played faster.

Trust me, I know it wasn't you. You can't compose that good. Anyway, I know that's Beethoven-why do you think I said it was way too slow? Uh, because it's mean't to be played faster.

Really?.... I was going to use that for studying, but I cannot find the actual tempo of the piece...

How about listening to a recording of the piece more stitisticly?

Find out chords and patterns found in the song, and pick out the separted melodies and sections of the overture. Find the sections should be easy since it's an overture; introduction to usualy an opera that has all the themes you will hear mixed into one song.

The problem is, I can't even find a MIDI of this piece :heh: .

Maybe I can PM you a recording or at least a good MIDI.

^I'd appreciate it :) .

EDIT: I decided not to start on III (now II- deleted I) for orchestration yet.. I need to study more. I decided to create an arrangement of "To Zanarkand" :sweat: for woodwinds + strings.

EDIT2:... I will actually not do it for woodwinds...

EDIT: I decided not to start on III (now II- deleted I) for orchestration yet.. I need to study more. I decided to create an arrangement of "To Zanarkand" :sweat: for woodwinds + strings.

Hm.. That's both a good and bad idea. :\ The reason for that is because if you orchestrate a piece that's pre-made, you have some restrictions on this and that, and you can't really apply your own sense of style to it. But the good thing is that it's straight to the point, you can learn the skeletal structures of orchestration. ;) Although my suggestion for you would be to write only for strings first, then you do another piece, adding brass, and then another piece doing all 3 families + percussion. The reason that you should do woodwinds last is because of its distinctive colours, as opposed to the homogenic colour of strings and the same throughout brassy quality of brass instruments. :) Finally, I would suggest you to get the book The Study of Orchestration by Samuel Adler, it's a great reference for orchestration if you do get into it. Good luck. ^.^

Yes, studying Woodwinds are really frigging hard to do.

I really only have done brass and strings and and (orchestral) percussion. Woodwinds are very hard to mix and match together.

Since I haven't posted anything in a while.... I might as well post this, it's better than nothing :heh: .

It's a transcription of "Fountain of Dreams" from Super Smash Bros (4 weeks ago, so I haven't known about the principles of orchestration yet). The only arranging I did was with the strings (since, for some reason, the MIDI had a seperate staff for pizzicato strings). Ranges are OK (I've checked them).

http://forums.ichigos.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2817&d=1155842088

1.03 MB

I can't upload it here because I have dial-up :bleh: .

EDIT: Ok... Finale says that the Trumpet parts are out of range, but as far as I know, Trumpet should be able to hit the C above the staff... :think:

EDIT: Ok... Finale says that the Trumpet parts are out of range, but as far as I know, Trumpet should be able to hit the C above the staff... :think:

Maybe you didn't change it to concert pitch? And trumpet parts can usually be higher than the expected range, depending on the skill of the trumpet player (I mean, in jazz the trumpet people can scream their trumpet up in like what? A high G?).

Maybe you didn't change it to concert pitch?

So... I suppose I'm supposed to put it in Concert Pitch?....

Compose everything in concert pitch first, then you change it back to the transposed full score.

Compose everything in concert pitch first, then you change it back to the transposed full score.

And lucky you, you can do it by clicking an icon-unlike myself with my band score >.<

XD I'm just lazy, it's good that you do it manually, but I don't want theory to get in my way when inspiration strikes. ;)

Piano solo (sorry, no orchestrated version yet :heh: )...

7 measured intro for an Adagio.

...what was that? Even though it's only a very short intro, I bet 99% of your audience would shut down the song by then.

:sweat: Oh well. That's the last of my compositions for the summer.

I'll probably post something in a month or two from now (since the band class I'm taking requires that I make a composition).

...what was that? Even though it's only a very short intro, I bet 99% of your audience would shut down the song by then.

I have to agree. It nearly stopped my blood circulation. x_x

^What they said, and in these kind of pieces, use grave as your tempo marking instead of adagio, because adagio is for 'lighter' pieces, while grave is for solemn and darker pieces. Also, your turns are weird, maybe you shouldn't use them as they are used... ._. Good luck. ;)

*1 month later:

:yawn: Well, I got the 1st 6 measures of the Concert Band (Theme and Variations) piece done, but take note of these 2 things:

1. I am using Finale Printmusic 2007 now, so only those that have a 2007 version of a Finale software can view this. (I can't get the MusicXML thing to work :heh: ).

2. The 7th measure is INCOMPLETE as of now. I'm not just going to only put that much in there yet.

(IGNORE WHAT WAS JUST HERE). I made a MIDI of this file.. so people can listen to it :) .

(COMMENTS PLEASE! I will be composing this for the band, so I don't want to embarass myself :heh: .)

Any examples of Theme and Variations pieces that I should listen to? I'm listening to Mozart's Clarinet Quintet K. 581- 4th Movement. (Allegretto Con Variazion).

you should know this, but clarinet solos usually cant be heard in the lower register (chalumeau or something like that?) id suggest either a higher octave or an english horn/oboe solo with a french horn/bassoon counterpart or just for support... but what do i know about orchestration :P i didnt know half the stuff you pplz were talking about in this whole thread o.o i kind of know ranges for band instruments, and i know some stuff about doubling... i just use whatever sounds good and seems playable o.o

and in the sixth measure, if you were building up to a faster tempo, then use the standard: an orchestral hit, with the snare bringing the orchestra up to tempo, then shoot for it o.o

^It's tough... I don't have an oboe, english horn, french horn, or bassoon in my band :heh:.

oh o.o thats tough. my band is one of the biggest out there (100-ish), and we dont have an english horn, either o.o i just heard its mellow sound is better than oboes in a solo. the bassoon can be soft sometimes, because we had a bassoon/french horn duet where the bassoon had the melody, but i think the french horn overpowered the bassoon o.o

oh o.o thats tough. my band is one of the biggest out there (100-ish), and we dont have an english horn, either o.o i just heard its mellow sound is better than oboes in a solo. the bassoon can be soft sometimes, because we had a bassoon/french horn duet where the bassoon had the melody, but i think the french horn overpowered the bassoon o.o

English horn is the alto version of an oboe, thus obviously they're lower and mellower.

Now, my band has a Tenor Sax now... what to double with? I'm guessing Trombone/Tuba? :unsure:

Now, my band has a Tenor Sax now... what to double with? I'm guessing Trombone/Tuba? :unsure:

2nd trumpet and/or 2nd clarinet an octave lower, if I were to choose.

I might as well put these arrangements here... the "Passion" one is directly off the orchestrated version.

THESE ARE ALL 2007 VERSIONED. NOTEPAD 2007 is now available to open these. ;)

Was "Adagio" the correct Tempo Marking for "Affections Touching Across Time"?...


EDIT: Oh, and I have more arrangements here: http://forums.ichigos.com/showpost.php?p=297684&postcount=1

More Arrangements, also ALL 2007 VERSIONED.

(and I know how hard the left hand gets to be in "Affections Touching Across Time")

More Arrangements here: http://forums.ichigos.com/showpost.php?p=297684&postcount=1

AN ACTUAL TRANSCRIPTION.

I don't know about the left hand, though... (also 2007 ;) )

EDIT: Updated Version, now complete!

New Composition... incomplete.

I know almost nothing about orchestration :heh: . I will have more instruments playing on the 1st 2 measures. 3rd measure and on.... not finished with the bass parts, and on all of it, I haven't thought of percussion stuff yet (which I'm the worst at :bleh: ). I just realized it sounds REALLY bad with the sounds.... :bleh: I had to consider using chromatics.... I was out of ideas.

Let me pick out the mistakes so you can change them...

1.) The first note of the third bar of the first clarinet is a HUGE leap (which is quite bad), and not everyone can do it. So it's not a good thing, my suggestion would be giving the note to second clarinet.
2.)Why does the bass clarinet part have the same dynamic markings every bar? You just need one in the beginning of the phrase.
3.)The flute mordent in bar six should be written out instead, cos everyone usually interpret it differently.
4.)The first two bars need a crescendo.
5.)I think your timpani roll wants to last for two bars, so you still need the tremolo marking in the second bar for timpani.
6.)The slurs in the clarinet needs to be extended to the staccato notes, or it's gonna sound really awkward when performed live.

1.) I'll change that. I play clarinet (which you should know), and I actually can do that... but I'll change it anyway.
2.) Of course, I knew that. It was a result of my copying and pasting.
3.) No one in the band knows what a mordent is, anyway. The band director will go through that :P . I will be playing in this anyway, and it would be good for the band to learn what this marking even is. If only I had Finale 2007, I would write one of those "Ossia" things....
4.) Yes, I'll change that.
5.) Ok. I never knew about this because in the 2006 version, the Timpani roll went on without the marking on it.
6.) I'll change it.

Any comments on the actual melody yet?

Please post midis.

^Wish I could. I am using an expired version of Printmusic 2007 for all of this :lol:. Update...

*UPDATE*

Comment on the theme, PLEASE, before I start writing variations of it.

The theme is pretty good. May I suggest the beginning should have a sforzando, then crescendo up to make the beginning trill interesting? In the 9th measure, the F# in the first clarinet sounds a little weird, but you might've been going for that effect? ;) Try a G#, you might like it... In the 28th measure, try changing the trumpet part so the last quarter note of the measure is two eighth notes, with the top notes being C and B and the bottom notes being G and G. You might've already considered this, but add in the bass drum on the beats that the timpani is not playing (except for the indended pauses). It might be a better idea to add that in a variation, so not too much is happening in the beginning. Good job, I like how the theme is played the second time (when the trumpets have it) ^_^

Having trouble with the title? How about something related to the desert? This song sounds like an underscore for a part in a movie where song tired and overworked people are constantly yelled at by slavedrivers... Meh, my interpretation o.o;

There are places with wrong articulations, again. And weird chords and etc... Ah... I'm too tired to pick them out... As a side note to Ajamesu's comment, don't do a sforzando on the trills, it's gonna turn out awkward.

Well, if not a sforzando, then maybe start out softer and crescendo, because the trill seems boring and long ;)

EDIT: Never mind, the G# in the clarinet 1 part sounds weird :P But, in the beginning, another thing you can do is give some parts (alto sax 1?) a D, E, F, F# (concert pitch) on beats 3 and 4 (eighth notes)

EDIT2: Ack, never mind you use PrintMusic 2007? Then I can just give this to you :heh:

I KNEW something sounded wrong in the Clarinet I part... (My bad ears :bleh: )...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Sir_Dotdotdot, if you meant (by the articulation) the ending eighth notes with the trumpet (meas. 15), that was done on purpose ;) .


in the beginning, another thing you can do is give some parts (alto sax 1?) a D, E, F, F# (concert pitch) on beats 3 and 4 (eighth notes)

I thought of adding another part, but I don't know WHAT to add. I did take a look at this (see "Rhapsody" in attachments)...

*starts experimenting*


Having trouble with the title? How about something related to the desert? This song sounds like an underscore for a part in a movie where song tired and overworked people are constantly yelled at by slavedrivers... Meh, my interpretation o.o;

I am BAD with titles :bleh: (explains why my contest entry was titled "No title in Bb/C Minor").

Rhapsody is NOT my composition.

Sir_Dotdotdot, if you meant (by the articulation) the ending eighth notes with the trumpet (meas. 15), that was done on purpose ;) .





Not that. I was talking about the clarinets' bar 8 pick-up to bar 9. :mellow: It's a pick-up, but you're cutting the flow of it.

Oh... (I'm assuming that I should put a slur mark to ALL of the notes, instead of slur 2 and tongue again, and slur...).

Sorry, but who wrote that piece, "Rhapsody"

I liked it, but it didn't have any good Rhapsodic-flow with the themes. Lol, wish he didn't have it SO sectional. Lol.

^Got it from http://www.finalemusic.com/showcase ;) .

Hurray for rhapsody, woot! That was an awsome piece! The tempo changes were wierd at bits but it was an awsome piece! Bows to whoever wrote it, :lol: :lol: :sweat:

:topic: I need comments...

lolz xD Everyone would rather comment on "Rhapsody" xD

Well, I helped and you didn't post any newer versions :/ Did you like the changes I made, by the way? o.o;

^I have added some stuff at the beginning, but I won't post it yet. I need songs that are available as a MIDI, and is a Theme and Variations piece.

Stuff I've listened to:

Clarinet Quintet (K.581)- Mozart (Movement IV)
Ah, Vous Dirai-je, Maman (K.265)- Mozart (A.K.A- Variations on "Twinkle, Twinkle, little star...)

Here it is:

Oh, you don't like what I added in in the beginning (the trombone and tuba part in second measure)? o.o; Fine with me. I like what you did with Alto sax 1 in measure 18. In the beginning measure, how about putting the tuba part an octave lower? The slurring marks from measure 8-9 in the clarinets seemed fine before (I actually preferred it because you're going for an aggressive feel (right?), and an aggressive feel doesn't have to flow (in my opinion)). Overall, the piece has gotten better ^_^

EDIT: Actually, that passage does sound better slurred :P Never mind, leave the clarinet part measures 8-9 as is :)

It sounds OK so far--I can't think of what to make you work on though, just sounds so odd.

It sounds OK so far--I can't think of what to make you work on though, just sounds so odd.

I can understand :heh: . I was out of ideas for... I don't know, almost a 1/2 year? I just thought of this recently.

Any Theme and Variation pieces that I should listen to, other than the list I provided on the last post?


Based on how it is now, what is a good title (besides, I'll be writing variations, and they'll be based on this theme.)? (I am BAD with titles :bleh: )

Variations... Hmm.. Well, maybe not for your style, but Beethoven's "Rage Over a Lost Penny" (Rondo a Capriccoso) is a very good song for theme and variations--but it also is a rondo some there's a few different themes in it before the variations of the main.

Good Luck. Oh!

Heres a link from Youtube to that song played by the best pianist, Evgeny Kissin :heh: http://youtube.com/watch?v=LqDj5186hUk

Oh! I just thought of something: if you do make the title desert-related, you could include a tambourine in your song ^_^ Wouldn't that be nice? How about "Sun Dance," or "_____'s Desert" (insert name of pertaining Greek god)? Something relating to the sun or a desert... what do YOU think the song represents? Be creative ^_^

Trombone? Desert felling? Thats' definately modern, or just a guessing game. I can't really get a tenor in my head for a desert.

Obviously: Guitar, String (Quartet), Trumpet(s) the most common ones.

I started writing the first variation... It's sort of Maestosoish.... but it seems too simple right now.... :heh:


NOTE: IT IS IN CONCERT PITCH.

Anyone that has Finale 2007, please tell me if any notes are out of range.

I'm pretty sure that the bass clarinet part is a little too low. ._. And that first chord you used for your first variation lacks brilliance, therefore if it's to be performed, it'll be very lacking. ... Wait, it's all playing G? Oh lord, don't do that, they'll be out of tune for sure.

I'm pretty sure that the bass clarinet part is a little too low. ._. And that first chord you used for your first variation lacks brilliance, therefore if it's to be performed, it'll be very lacking. ... Wait, it's all playing G? Oh lord, don't do that, they'll be out of tune for sure.

It's in Concert Pitch, so it looks low. ;) Actually, if you take it off of concert pitch, you'll see it's actually (a bit) high for a Bass Cl. part (which I will be playing).

I never did know about the "out of tune" stuff... I probably will add some harmonies.

It's in Concert Pitch, so it looks low. ;) Actually, if you take it off of concert pitch, you'll see it's actually (a bit) high for a Bass Cl. part (which I will be playing).



I know it's in concert pitch, but it's still a little too low (not saying it's unplayable), but it just wont be as resonant. :mellow:

^Oh, I get it... I might put it up an octave, then... the lowest note I'll probably give it is the 1st A below the staff.

Anyone that has Finale 2007, are the notes IN RANGE?... If not, let me know.

(If you don't know how to check, in Finale 2007 (or at least, I think this is how you check), click Plug-ins> Scoring and Arranging> Check Range.)

Anyone that has Finale 2007, are the notes IN RANGE?... If not, let me know.



These programs' range stuff are usually unreliable, in my opinion. Use orchestration books or something along that line instead. (That's why you memorize the instrument's ranges.)

^I just haven't memorized the Alto/Tenor sax range yet, and trombone/tuba. I'll just check it now...

How is the chord now? Suggestions for a title?

(I'll probably switch some Bass Clarinet stuff).

EDIT: Another switch...

If I remember correctly Alto and tenor sax can play as low as Bb bellow the staff and Bari sax can play A (Not in concert pitch). I don't remember exactly what the roof is before they have to start using harmonics but I think it's somewhere around the first F above the staff.

I like what you are doing with this piece. Only thing I would like to say is make sure you give the saxes and low brass interesting parts too! They want to have just as much fun as those with the melody.

A name... It reminds me of something an evil person of royalty would march around to. Why not then... The March of the Archduke

^Exactly! That's why I was thinking desert-like - a sultan! The Sultan's Procession? Would that be a fitting title? The March of the Sultan? Something to that effect...

The second variation is okay so far... To contradict that variation, follow up with a faster version of the theme, it could be catchy :)

It's not in 2/4, so I wouldn't really call it a march.

~~~

I still wouldn't consider that opening chord for your first variation good; it's too clustered and lacks brilliance. And right after that, where you directly doubled the two clarinet parts can cause a great deal of issues with tuning. Then after that, the flute plays a fairly high note, while the others play in the lower registers, and this makes the orchestration quite thin.

I like what you are doing with this piece. Only thing I would like to say is make sure you give the saxes and low brass interesting parts too! They want to have just as much fun as those with the melody.

Of Course :P . I learned about this from a POORLY (and I mean REALLY poorly) arranged version of Sousa's "Semper Fidelis". There was only one trumpet in our band at the time :lol: , and he was the only one that had the melody.


The second variation is okay so far... To contradict that variation, follow up with a faster version of the theme, it could be catchy :)

Most of the variations will be tempo changes.


I still wouldn't consider that opening chord for your first variation good; it's too clustered and lacks brilliance. And right after that, where you directly doubled the two clarinet parts can cause a great deal of issues with tuning. Then after that, the flute plays a fairly high note, while the others play in the lower registers, and this makes the orchestration quite thin.

The chord- I might start with a Bass Intro (not just a chord) instead. I do feel like the chord I put there was too simple.
The Clarinet doubling- Will most likely NOT be in the final copy... (bass intro)
Flute (high note)- Will be taken out... (Bass intro)

*I took out ALL of Variation I that I had, and added a bass part...

Pressure.... My teacher's talking about this with all of the other music directors....

I may be the first one that composed a song for a band in this school (maybe in the history of the school)... :think: XD

Think about the new change in variation I (I will be keeping it)... title suggestions?

You should post a MIDI or Mp3. Bear in mind that some of us, or heck, even most of us can't be arsed to download a new version of Finale every time the guys at CodaMusic decides to release a new version with half-an-update.

^Would, but I can't... I'm using an expired version of Finale Printmusic, so I can't convert. I made the concert band piece before the trial expired. I can still use it, I can only save (as a .MUS).

I love all your music expecially the fountain of dreams

It's not in 2/4, so I wouldn't really call it a march.

Not a march per se, but something with the feel of, as GT said, a villain of high nobility walking down an aisle, servants bowing down to him, etc., etc., etc. Besides, marches don't have to be in 2/4 (right? :huh: )

More Arrangements, also ALL 2007 VERSIONED.

(and I know how hard the left hand gets to be in "Affections Touching Across Time")

More Arrangements here: http://forums.ichigos.com/showpost.php?p=297684&postcount=1

I'm not sure but Affections Touching Across Time sounds like To Love Ends, from Inu Yasha (you can find it on the ichigo homepage).
Is this the same song with a different name?

Besides, marches don't have to be in 2/4 (right? :huh: )

2/4 is the standard march time signature, cos of the strong-weak strong-weak pattern, it won't work with 4/4 or most other signature.

I'm not sure but Affections Touching Across Time sounds like To Love Ends, from Inu Yasha (you can find it on the ichigo homepage).
Is this the same song with a different name?

It's an Arrangement, and I guess it is the same song with a different name, because the person that requested that gave me "Affections Touching Across Time" for a titile. All of the other stuff near there are ALSO arrangements. ;)

Comments on composition?..... http://forums.ichigos.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3663&d=1165011396

FIrst of all, take out that four measure rest. Have a retard to the end of the theme and put a fermata over the measure divider. It will sound a lot better.

It sounds good so far. Everything that goes with theory sounds and look good, but I have to admit I hate the piece. It's annoying imo..

FIrst of all, take out that four measure rest. Have a retard to the end of the theme and put a fermata over the measure divider. It will sound a lot better.

It sounds good so far. Everything that goes with theory sounds and look good, but I have to admit I hate the piece. It's annoying imo..

Yep, it's not that good... it's probably the weird chormatic melody I put in that became really annoying... :sweat: . The melody just happened to come up in my mind, out of nowhere.

:bleh: It just got more annoying when my director told me that the Timpanies that the band has can't play that low, so I had to put it up higher x_x . I wrote G.P. instead of putting a Fermata because Finale wouldn't pause it correctly (G.P. means "General Pause", so none of the performers are performing at this part, until the conductor cues them).

What did you mean by the "four-measured rest"? :think:

(G.P. means "General Pause", so none of the performers are performing at this part, until the conductor cues them).



It means 'grand pause' actually. [/music term nazi]

It means 'grand pause' actually. [/music term nazi]

I've heard it being called BOTH terms... Finale Notepad says "G.P=General Pause" but I doubt it. I've also heard of a Cesura (the "railroad tracks // " being called a grand pause... Too much interpretations @_@....

How do you NOTATE a switch in a Timpani Part (like, say that the lowest timpani is to switch notes in the middle of the song... what would you type for text?) ...

Update will be coming after I edit THIS post...

A switch in a timpani part? Is that possible? It might be hard to change and tune a timpani while the band is playing o.o;

EDIT: With new variation I, it sounds like someone's running away from something... o.o; The beginning of the new variation seems a little too long... I don't know... but it's definitely a good beginning :) For the title, I have no more ideas :mellow:

It's not hard, it's highly possible, cos the drums are side by side here. *Grabs orchestration book for accurate timp. sizes*. Well, here you go: 32" (C below bass staff to A on bass staff), 28" (F below bass staff to C on bass staff), 25" (B flat on staff to F on staff), 23" (D on staff to B above staff). After you remembered which drum you use, just write '23" to 28"' or something like that.

Thanks. Now I can write it out... in the 2nd variation.

Comments Please, and I know it did get really simple in the 2nd variation (Measures 34-41). I may be taking this excerpt off (34-41), but I'm using this just for now. :heh:

I have a feeling that the variations should have better transitions as opposed to fermatas and pauses. As for the second variation... I'll comment more later... *Headache* But it's not bad at all! :)

I have a feeling that the variations should have better transitions as opposed to fermatas and pauses. As for the second variation... I'll comment more later... *Headache* But it's not bad at all! :)

I'm getting a headache by composing this :bleh:... chromatics.... I've used it a lot, then there's the annoying Flute mordents...

I will try to come up with another variation (without a fermata before it).

Well, it's not quite a theme and variations piece, but you could use some of it's transitional ideas, I guess, because the pieces vary from majestic, to light and happy, to a dramatic love song in 5/8, to a fast and humorous piece. The song is Armenian Dances (Part 1). See if you can study it. If not, I think there are a few recordings on the internet :)

^Thanks...

Comments? http://forums.ichigos.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3675&d=1165104018

Ooh, I liked it :) Nothing negative to say about this variation :) Except one thing: I thought it was a little too short...

I expanded Variation II... Comments please (:bleh: I have to have it done soon... all of the teachers are talking about it... )

:heh: I still need help on a title... I'm thinking _______'s Theme...

Comments Please!

I added a solo clarinet part (which I may play, depending on the opinions I get here :heh: )... and I need to know whether I should take it out of the song, or not.

Also, PLEASE comment on Var. II.... I hope to have this done before Christmas (:bleh: My teacher really wants it done soon).

(How many variations does a "Theme and Variations" piece (as a minimum) have?)

Since you need it done fast, I'll try to have no clemency whatsoever @_@

The beginning has been erking me, as I think that the first note of the third measure should be really loud. The band should come down after the first note. Measure 27: the second grace note on the clarinet sounds weird, but it might be the way NotePad plays it... Measure 34-37, it sound weird because theres little harmony (might need long-note parts?). Keep the melody in the bass though... Do that somehow ;) Measure 36, the tenor sax part (I think its the last note) sounds weird. Rest of the song sounds okay, good clarinet solo.

Comments Please! (It's really urgent right now... I must finish this before the Christmas break my school has (Dec. 23))...

Changes have been made... but for some reason (around 34-37) it sounds smudgy...

To be honest, the variations are actually not too well done. I mean, the tempo changes, new parts are added and all that, but it still sounds the same. :mellow: I don't know a way that can help you, but I'm just saying.

~~~
On the other hand, the bass clarinet part around bar 33 is too low to play the melody, I'm sure the band will overpower it.

Now... back to studies... *scans Mozart Clarinet Quintet* :heh:

I know it didn't go so well, so I'm studying rhythm changes in variations.

EDIT: Change in Var. II- (Don't say I didn't warn you, but it may be really annoying to your ears XD ).

Comments, Please! Comments, again, are needed quickly, as I must finish this before Christmas break.

EDIT3: Wow @_@ . I've been exploding with ideas after reading Sir_Dotdotdot's comment -_- .

EDIT4: Var. III is only a draft, so I may take it out...

I just realized what m 9-year-old sister is right: your song sounds like an elephant, which is why I was think of India xD So, in honor of that, base the song's title on an elephant :) The Gypsy's Elephant? *think*

The part that starts at measure 33 sounds better with the alto saxes. Bar 27 in the clarinets sounds better in a way... I liked how you started Var. III, and how you changed how Var. I starts, it sounds much more exciting :) The tenor sax part at around 36 still sounds a bit weird...

I'm sorry I can't do much, I'm terribly busy ATM, but I'll try to get back to you later, okay? :\

:think: Good title... *starts researching on titles* I may actually use it XD .

The tenor sax is meant to be played a 3rd above the melody (the low brass)... For an example of what I meant, check the trumpets in meas. 14. There's a div part, and I wanted the Tenor Sax to play the top notes.

*UPDATE:

I added percussion... Comments Please! (and really needed... My teacher gave me a SET DATE of when to put it on...

How do you "direct" a piece? That's what my teacher said I'd do....

How are you going to direct the piece if you're playing the bass clarinet and the clarinet solo? :mellow:

In my opinion, the snare drum ruined the feel of an elephant o.o; It just doesn't fit in the theme. The fast variations could use the snare, though, so keep it in. The bass drum and timpani should be playing in the beginning, playing on different beats (like how the saxes answer the flutes and clarinets when the trumpet has the melody).

*takes snare drum out in the beginning*

Good Question... (about the directing)... No one else my age can do the 16th note runs, so I'll talk about it with my director ;) .

Hmm... I didn't like the triplet part at measure 27. It felt to complex for the piece at that time. Also, in that section I think you use the base drum too much. It will end up drowning out the bass part to your piece. Alternating snare drum and bass drum just seems too juvenile to me.

As of now, I think you are favoring your flutes and clarinets too much. I have only seen the saxes and the low brass play countermelody so far. Remember they too need their moment to shine!

And I do believe your director is using "Directing" and "Conducting" interchangeably. Meaning, I think he wants you to be the one to wave your arms around with the stick to make it look like you are doing something. :lol:

As of now, I think you are favoring your flutes and clarinets too much. I have only seen the saxes and the low brass play countermelody so far. Remember they too need their moment to shine!



I agree. Playing with timbres is a good way to do variations.

Triplets- Yes, it does seem complex, but it's all I can think of...
Snare Drum/Bass Drum- I have to add some sort of percussion x_x... I am bad with it, as you notice...
Timbres- Yes, I know I use Flutes and Clarinets too much :heh: . Wait until the 2nd variation :shifty: .

*UPDATE:

I took out most of the Snare Drum-Bass Drum alternation parts... and added a bells and cymbal part. I'm aiming for something big at the 2nd variation when the cymbals are playing.

My director extended the due date to the end of January :) .

EDIT: Christmas Compostion Entry... Comments Please!

EDIT2: Ignore the other compostion that was here....

In response to your PM, no problem :)

Interesting... Well, I don't have much to comment on, elaborate on the second variation, and I'll comment some more. I also agree that saxes should have the melody at least once, because saxes sound elephant-ish xD Good luck with your CCCC entry (and your Concert Band piece :) )!

For god sake, take out that grand pause. Just have a fermata on that last note and go into the first variation. You lose every bit of suspense.

I have to study Rimsky-Korsakov's music for a music project... which should be interesting. ^_^

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Not much of an update, unfortunately :heh: . I might as well warn people: I will start using chromatics a lot, to the rate where people will get headaches @_@ (even me :heh: ). This will start as soon as I post the next composition (not the Concert Band piece, but I have an idea for a Clarinet + Piano). Don't say I didn't warn you :P .


I also cannot enter for the Christmas compostion contest, in case people are wondering (no ideas).

IN NEED OF COMMENTS... (really, I have to finish it by Jan. 20)...

See the .MUS file in my previous post...

Ok, a few more things here....

Your Alto Sax 2 part starts on it's lowest note, so it may or may not be able to hit it right away, depending on how skilled they are. The Bari Sax could go down an octave if you wanted in most places since it's lowest note is it's written B bellow the staff. You trumpets may have a hard time with those octave jumps at 24. It wouldn't be hard for the skilled players, but the ones that are kinda "not as tallented" would have a hard time playing it. The trumbones could play a little higher, they have a nice sound in their upper register. The same goes for the trumpets. You gotta give them more stuff up in the higher octave! That's where the true beauty of the instrument lies! Other than that i like what I hear so far. I can tell that the piece is about to really open up from where you last left off. Keep it up!

I know I can make the new variation louder, but I'll get to that later.

COMMENTS ARE URGENT... NEEDS TO BE FINISHED BY JAN. 20.

Really...
COMMENTS ARE NEEDED!....

16 days left...

Wow, that is really impressive! I would try to give you some kind of critisism (sp?) or point out some problems, but I know next to nothing when it comes to composing for the orchestra. So, I'll just tell you the good things I noticed. :P

There was a lot of variety and I really enjoyed the way the theme switched from one instrumental group to another. I also think there was a good ammount of balance in the orchestration, and you used the trills very nicely. (A lot of people just do NOT know how to use trills!)

I also really like the clarinet part at measure 26 and throughout the song. I did think that some of the transitions were a little rough though, and the end felt kind of abrupt. For instance, the transition into measure 43 was going somewhat smoothly at first, but it just doesn't feel right in my opinion.

That aside though, I was very impressed in the least. Great job, and keep up the hard work!!!

Measure 25, the snare roll should decrescendo, unless you suddenly want the snare to disappear... I like the new variation, maybe some cymbal rolls should be added to increase the suspense? Ooh, and that old presto variation (Var. III) you originally had after the clarinet solo? That could be incorporated somewhere, and when the last note is struck, that could be the time for a rhythmic two-measure timpani (+bells?) feature w/ short cymbal rolls, and then the dramatic variation :D

Other than that, good job ^_^

EDIT: ^ I somewhat agree ;)

Okay, excuse me if I'm too picky since it's going to be performed.

~~~

1. In the opening, the alto sax starts from mp to ff while the flutes start at f. Sure it'll make an interesting effect, but they're all doing a crescendo, so it's going to sound weird for an opening. Either make the flutes start at mp or make the sax start at f.

2. Notate your bass clarinet properly; use the bass clef, please. When you transpose it properly later on, then you can change it back to the treble clef.

3. At bar 8, your snare is playing at forte while the rest are still twindling in their mf; unless you want the snare to solo, keep it down.

4. I really have some doubts at bar 16 where your clarinets play that fancy triplet part, cos remember, you're at presto.

5. At 29/30, you suddenly changed the mf's to p's. Add the word 'subito' before the p's, it's clearer.

6. Then at 31, your clarinets does that eighth note thing. Slur that entire thing and do stagger breathing instead; it's going to be a pain to hear if you hear people breathing together every 2-4 bars.

7. At 37, the flute's dynamic marking should have subito in front of the p.

8. Your bass clarinet cadenza around the Andante part is going to sound strange. I suggest you to make it at least 1 octave higher.

9. At bar 48, are you sure about the 3 octaves doubling with the flutes, clarinets 1 and clarinets 2? I surely think it's not really a bright idea.

10. At bar 54, I am also quite worried about the bass clarinet's versatility in playing those sixteenth notes. I suggest you to make it an octave higher.

11. At bar 56, you make the flute play that high E in mp, I find that quite hard, considering the experience of your band.

12. The final bar of what you have so far was all octave doublings? Wow. No. Won't do.

:mellow: That enough criticisms for now?

Finally, some criticisms... I needed something.

On...
2: The bass clarinets are used to treble clef... (will discuss with director).
4: Already discussed; if he [the director] needs to, he'll slow it down.
8: If you didn't notice, I put in "Bb Clarinet" at a few measures before it.
9: I just found all I needed to create the effect I want is to take the clarinets 2 out.
10: Already done, but I need to know the player's potential first (when dealing with the notes above 3rd space C).
11: I was just told that the best band at our school would play it (which, is basically, a high school band). Then there's some instruments that I was just told that I needed to add.
12: Yes, I just took it out (I read at the garritan.com "Principles of Orchestration" tutorials that the most common beginner's mistake is to overuse doublings).

I'm willing to give you an artistic review of your composition, whilst the more experienced ones give you the techical reviews. But I need a MIDI file to listen to it!

^I'll PM someone...

Sorry for DP, but I can't get a MIDI file, unfortunately.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The director said to leave the Bass Clarinet part at a treble clef (as I said, they can't read bass). Here's an update...

:mellow: You still don't get what I mean. What I was saying was that you didn't transpose your score, therefore all the instruments are in concert pitch at the moment. So right now, you can use the bass clef cos it's (the score) in concert pitch, but once you transpose it (the bass clari. is going to be a major 9th higher on the staff), then you can change it back to the treble. If you still don't get what I mean, I'll try to clarify more.

PS: That fancy clarinet cadenza of yours (I'm very sure) is too low for clarinet.

Oh... I get it. So, I should use the bass clef in concert pitch for the Bass Clarinet...

Do you mean the solo? If you didn't notice, it notes "Bb Clarinet" at that part (Meas. 41). When I didn't transpose it, it looked too low, so when I insert "Bb Clarinet", it plays it an octave higher (which is how it should be).

If no one noticed, I had to add some new instruments to the score.... Can someone help me on how to use them (more specifically, doubling)?

I feel like I've given the Piccolo a bad part :bleh: and I've never used Baritone Sax, Baritone, or Bassoon. As it mentions above, what should I double these with?

Help, anyone?

EDIT: Just noticed something... the Piccolo is too low when I put it back in the "Transposing Pitch"....
Better update... see .MUS file

o.O You have a bassoon but not an oboe... Your band is strange.

~~~

Indeed, the piccolo's part is quite poor. At least make everything an octave higher, making piccolo playing at its low register is like telling it to shut up (that's why you won't see piccolo in my pieces unless I need screaming high notes). And yes, for once flute/piccolo octave doubling is allowed, since they are in the same family and it's more preferred than unison.

Treat your baritone sax like trombone, as their range are similar. Oh, and baritone is even easier: make it play tuba parts an octave higher. Bassoon is more like a wild card in band, it can reinforce the lower brass or horns, or it can reinforce bass clarinet, but, if this wasn't a band piece, I would say that bassoon should have it's own part, no doubling.

As for the solo, yes, please, put that part up an octave higher, cos I don't understand why you made it so low and then an octave higher. I'm sure it's gonna be a pain for the conductor and confusing for the performer.

Update... the last bar on this one is WAY better, rather than the octave doublings I had.

Comments Needed!

(Ranges will be checked soon... :heh: ).

In your new section starting at 51, I would have my doubts that your baritone player(s) would have nible enough fingers to play those line of eight notes. (I mean, they are the rejected trumpet players after all :lol:). You probably will want them to play a slower lick.

I'm still crying on how low you have the trumpets playing. see----> :cry:

I also noticed you do not have a French Horn.

I'm hoping to feature each instrument family in this song... The thing about the trumpets (in my band): it's hard for them to hit a 5th line (on the staff) F (not concert pitch). I don't get it either...

The eighth notes... I'll have to think about that.

Yep, no French Horn... what a weird band...

Wow, that's very weird. A band with flutes that can play high E on mp but that can't trumpets that can't hit an F? Scary. :mellow:

At measure 31, if the piccolo's at f, then it'll play over the band, I suggest that it goes with the flow of the clarinets (cresc. then sub. p). Also, I noticed the bass drum doesn't play anything in the entire piece except in the 3rd and 4th measures o.o; At 53, I'd give the trombone part to the baritones because I think that part will be easier on valves than on a slide (unles your trombones are used to fast parts?) That's pretty much it... Sounding good ^_^

Wow, that's very weird. A band with flutes that can play high E on mp but that can't trumpets that can't hit an F? Scary. :mellow:

Scary indeed... the band is very unbalanced, with the woodwinds usually being the better players.

Update...

Uh, I think in just about every high school band, the woodwinds are the better players XD

Update...

At bar 52, where you have a piano after the cresc, add subito, or it's gonna drive your band nuts. :mellow:
~~~
Asides from being technical to help you finish your somewhat 'homework'-like composition, I think this piece isn't really theme and variation. I mean, even if you change your tempo, there's still this same pulse and feeling throughout. Also, the progression is too same and predictable, so it gets dull after perhaps like... 40 bars. Yes, your opening was grand and will capture a lot of attention, but it was a disappointment when your main theme comes in. The use of instruments weren't too bright too, I must admit. Yes, you did follow my suggestions about the little 'sections of doubling', and it's acceptable for educational music. But in reality, it's not really interesting. I suggested it that way because it was easier for your band to play (cos I expected your band to be a grade 9 high school band), and perhaps easier for you to write. Though, when you write something with a big ensemble next time, try to actually use some creativity to 'double'. Cos right now, it sounds like you're just trying to get the melody out and the harmony thick, rather than making it sound interesting. Also, the timpani can be exposed more rather than just keeping the rhythm and the harmony. It has a very beautiful tone if you use it carefully. You're also wasting the bassoon. Bassoon is quite exotic in bands and even in smaller orchestras. You should actually give it more special stuff to play and actually appreciate the presence of a bassoon. Asides from those, I also noticed that you give many important motifs to the clarinet. I understand that you're a clarinetist (duh) and you like it very much, but by overusing it throughout can cause the tone of the piece be very very dull. Also, like Porsche stated before, give the trumpets more important part. You know what trumpets are for in band? SCREAMING THE LOUD NOTES!!!! Yes, so it needs to be much much more exploited. I also noticed that you used flutes in its higher register. Yes, it's true that their speciality is high notes. But did you know that flute low notes are really beautiful too? If so, use it. By using different sounds for music (band music in your case) can create individuality of the composer and the piece, cos right now, your piece sounds really typical for a band piece and it's not really that interesting. I hope that you'll continue to work hard though.

Took off EVERY variation...

I never (I admit it...) took the time to figure out which timbres go with which ones. So I decided to (and I found out the Bass Clarinet quarter-notes were not going well). Then I just had to take out everything else and go back to studies...

I realized I didn't follow the "form" of the variation I was studying (Mozart Clarinet Quintet- K.581), so I decided to study it more closely.

There's a new first variation, but something sounds smudgy, does anyone know?

(I still have 2-3 weeks).

EDIT: and I just realized something... we're playing a "Theme and Variations" piece in band :bleh: . Do not comment on the Bass Clarinet part in terms of resonance right now...

Even though the ideas are better in your new version, you need to watch out for your orchestration and chordal structures. An example would be bassoon's playing range being too far away from the other instruments. There are other ones; try to pick them out yourself.

The "smudginess" in the first variation is caused by the piccolo interfering with the chord progression (I think o.o; )

Update...

Again, COMMENTS ARE URGENTLY NEEDED! (Remember it uses 2007...)

Your trumpeters are gonna have a hard time with that o.o; but it works nicely :) I love how the baritone and tuba's entrance smooths it out :) The blurriness is still there. It's caused by the piccolo and flute parts interfering with each other (check the chords and see if the parts interfere with the chords). This new variation is coming together quite nicely :)

Your trumpeters are gonna have a hard time with that o.o; but it works nicely :)

What? It's perfectly fine rhythmically, melodically and range-wise. :mellow:

Oh... it's the E Natural and F... :heh:

About the trumpeters: they are not the ones in my band that I was talking about (that will be playing this)... it's our best band in this school :) .

Oops, never mind, just read ^ :whistle:

In the bass part, where they have dotted half notes. I would probably tie them together in four measure phrases, cressendoing on the first two measures, and decressendoing the last two, just to give that part a little more personality.

The trumpet part is better! You are using the uper range, which is good. I would just add some more harmony with a second part to the trumpets, to make the sound more full. Plus, it's not always a good idea at the high school level to have a whole section of instruments play the higher note because they will sound a bit out of tune. In a Professional group that would be a different thing though.

Good work! ^_^

Update...

Comments Needed!

Hi i also play the clarinet and enjoy your work.I did a solo for my concert and the udience enjoyed it very much.^_^

Suggested book: "Arranging for the Concert Band" by Frank Ericson. If you're in Canada, you might have played his music in one of your band concert/kwanis festival.

This book helped me alot with arranging for school bands. It even tells you the suggested ranges for a typical Jr/high school band as well as the actual instrument limit.

Another Update...

Again, comments are needed! (Deadline extended to Jan. 31/Feb. 1)

I don't know... Even though your piece is friendly and compatible with your band, the variation (in my opinion) is quite out of context. Yes, it's good to have contrast, but your theme and first variation just didn't work. To simply put it, it didn't flow. The two parts didn't match. In my opinion, in a theme and variation piece it's very important for the parts to connect.

So I had two options:

1. To take off the first variation, and make a new one
2. To take off the theme, and try to make it sound somewhat like the variation.

I chose two :heh: .

Comments (theme isn't finished~ I basically need the theme and Var. I compared right now).

Sorry for DP, but comments are really needed...

I'm planning to repeat the trumpet melody with the woodwinds...

Are you sure your flutes can fluttertongue? Cos I'm sure not everyone can do it.

One of my friends is a flautist in that band, and they can fluttertongue ;) .

Okay, suit yourself, but don't expect eveness though. :mellow: If I were to orchestrate, I'd keep fluttertongue for solo passages.

(I did some more studying on "special effects" such as pizz. and fluttertonguing).

So the fluttertonguing didn't go so well after doing some studies.

Update...

Again, your pauses are horrible. Just do a fermata on a from one the the bar of your variation.

It didn't flow well together, and it didn't really get me thinking of any neat chords or themes. :(

Anyone willing to midify the .mus file for me?

^Here's a 2006 File :) .

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So, after analyzing most of Mozart's Theme and Variations pieces, I realized I made the theme too complex. Most of his themes (most of the time) had almost all of the notes being quarter notes, so I decided to start over again.

It's basically a Theme and Variations based on the "No Title in Bb/C Minor" that I entered in the last Free Theme contest here. It should be easier, since most of it is quarter notes and half notes.

Comments Needed. (Every day counts right now. I only have until the 31st.)

Also Needed: Suggestions for a better title. My director will not want to put "No title in Bb Minor" on the list :heh: .

Anyone willing to midify the .mus file for me?

Again, comments needed! (Only 15-16 Days left).

Update on the Theme...

I will probably post an update every 1 or 2 days, until it is finished.

~Comments Needed!

13 Days Left!

Feedback Needed... it uses 2006.

(Sorry for TP).

Measure 10 ;) Flute/clarinet parts, verify them...

Since you're in dire need of help, I'll just tell you what needs fixing (all notes said are in concert pitch): flute Ab and clarinet 1 G, flute Eb and clarinet D. Can't have that in measure 10.

Measure 39, piccolo's Bb doesn't sound right. Measure 40, piccolo/flute's Ab with bassoon's G. Measure 41, flute's Eb with bassoon's E natural.

(will cont., g2g)

Wrong file :lol:.

Now THIS is the 2006 version ;) .

COMMENTS NEEDED! (Sorry for wrong file :heh: ).

In the first few measures, it would sound better to my ears if the tuba played the root of the chords more often.

Update...

Again, 12 DAYS LEFT!

If no one noticed, this is my piece "No title in Bb/C Minor" orchestrated.

Please, be as picky as possible, before I do something dumb, and start over again.

After the trill of the piccolo and flute, you have a pianissimo marking, make it sub. pp instead of just pp.

What if in that trill at measures 8 and 9,you make it a half note in measure nine then G and Ab eigth notes to finnish the measure out.

Measure 9-10, the tuba should play the root of the chord an octave lower so it sounds more interesting. Measure 13-14, I don't think maj7 chords go well there... Measure 25, the root note should be in the bass somewhere. In Var. I, the flute/piccolo parts got just a little too repetitive (vary the last measure a little every other time it's played).

More instruments to add! :heh:

I have to add now:

~An oboe
~2 French Horns

The bassoon player dropped out of band for the 2nd semester :bleh: .

MP3's will be provided for the next 30-days (30-day trial :heh: ).

Comments Please!

~About the .MIDI file, it plays as bells on my computer :huh: . The bells are supposed to be flutes, just in case someone's wondering.

Except now you're missing chord factors and it lost some of the richness it probably needs.

^Like what? :think: I've tried making a piano reduction on this, and all I can find is that I didn't put enough different notes down.

Update~

For some reason, I can't post the MP3 up right now :huh: .

On the .MIDI file, Bells= Flute.

10 DAYS LEFT! COMMENTS NEEDED.

I agree with Deathraider. Throughout your piece, the harmony is very very thin.

~Added some more harmonies to the beginning...
~Instead of repeating the 4-measured trumpet phrase twice, I gave the French Horns the melody.

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I need this question answered: Is this even close to being a good variation?

~Clarinetist

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May be a bit off-topic, but has anyone heard the song "Winchester Chronicles" by James S.... (forgot last name) for Concert Band? Opinions on it?

I didn't fix the whole thing, but maybe this will give an idea of what I would do.

Thank you! I was trying to find out how to get a smooth effect like that...

*will post update tomorrow*

Just make sure to be careful and not play to much of the root of the chord, and it's better if the lowest playing instrument plays the bass note.

EDIT: :P Bad Attempt... will post update in next post (7:00 CST).

After a *better* study of Orchestration, I have this.
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COMMENTS NEEDED! 10 DAYS LEFT!

Again, on the .MIDI, Bells=Flute.

*Need on the comments:

1. Is it a good variation?
2. Orchestration Issues/Chord Issues
3. If possible, include a .MUS file of what you would do. ;)

~Clarinetist

The first half of the variation was pretty dull because of all the repetition. I also think your mordents in your clarinets are unnecessary. Also, in the beginning, your flutes should play an octave higher, cos it's weak in the lower register (especially when you have the brass and saxes playing straight harmonies). I'll comment more later. :mellow:

First of all, get rid of the tritone in measure 23 (I would suggest moving the bottom flute down to an F, and then in the first beat of 24 up to an A). In 28, I don't think it's a good idea to have 2 instruments playing each of the doubled passing tones (or wherever else you have them). In measure 32, you have the trumpet suddenly play a random note that doesn't fit in the chord. I assume that's an accident, but you need to get rid of it. Those parallel fourths in measure 42 sound awful, so I suggest you just take the harmonizing instrument off that and give it a counterpoint.

The bari-sax's sound is too heavy for the delicate beginning (I think o.o; Maybe the tenor sax would be better). Also, I suggest that the harmony in the trumpets should be lower than the melody. The mordents in the clarinet do seem unnecessary.

The bari-sax's sound is too heavy for the delicate beginning (I think o.o; Maybe the tenor sax would be better).

Had a orchestration lesson from my director :heh: . I learned never to double Bass Cl. with Tenor Sax. I thought that was applicable before, but it's not the case, which is the reason for the Bari. Sax... (I don't know about using Trombone/Tuba with Tenor Sax at the beginning).

I took a lot out of the first variation out (not permanent yet). Will take out some of the passing tone doublings (if needed)...

TEMPORARY title: "Balance" Etude, especially made for the Eagle Band. For a fact, I know that the band is not well with balancing (most of the time). (Example: If anyone's heard "John Williams Trilogy", the trumpets sound at a pp when all you can hear is woodwinds at a mf) :lol:.

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Now... very nervous :sweat:. I was just told by my director that this song (will most likely; he hasn't heard it yet) will be played by the Eagle Band in the "Chicago Heritage Music Festival" (or something like that...). So, the deadline is extended until February 15.

But still, every day counts, so COMMENTS ARE NEEDED!

*Var. II is still incomplete. Just an idea I came up with this morning.

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Comments Needed:

*Var. I comments...
*Orchestration/Chord Issues
*Suggestions for a better title? :P

The beginning, you have everything playing piano, and so your melody won't stand out. Around bar 49, you have your FLUTE playing higher than the PICCOLO, that's just not right. At bar 46, having your piccolo playing softer than the flute is also unacceptable. Your timpani part is also quite dull, I'm sure your percussionists won't appreciate the fact that they have barely anything to do in a band piece. Oh, and at bar 37 (where your trumpets have grace notes), expect it to sound horrible because it's really hard to get it right. So far, your bass lines are extremely boring, I suggest you to look into that. ._.

Oh, and for actual comments: I find your variation too 'draggy'. It just went on and on and on and on and on. There aren't anything interesting that captured my attention. It was a good idea for your oboe to appear as a fresh sound in the middle, but it became part of the draggyness afterward. I also felt that your opening was too uninteresting. Band openings are usually the attention capturers, but it doesn't capture my attention, at all. :mellow: Make it more powerful, distinctive and more of a band piece.

I liked what you did to get rid of the tritone.

An attempt to make the beginning somewhat interesting... adding Percussion! :heh:... :bleh:

COMMENTS ARE NEEDED! Do not comment on Var. I yet... nothing has changed...:heh:

Note that I am completely new at Percussion, so don't assume that I know anything ;) .